Traveller-digest       Tuesday, June 24 1997       Volume 1997 : Number 1471



(R)1996. Traveller is a registered trademark of FarFuture Enterprises.
All rights reserved.

The following topics are covered in this digest:

Re: T4.1 Char Gen Checklist
Re: Hardware, firmware, software
Task System
RE: Latest Vote Count (Dont forget me!)
Re: Marc's Comments and a suggestion or two
Re: [T97#1444] Gushing about the new UWP
ANOMALIES
New Gaming Term!
New mailing list member...may I introduce myself?
Re: Minimum TL for...
Coreward Maelstrom... a Vargr threat scenario
Re: Deckplan Question?
Re: Character Generation Pages in WFW95
Re: Suggestion for Task System Improvemet
Re: information...
Re: T4 Task Rationale
Re: Deckplan Question?
Skills = Stats? I don't think so
Corsairs

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 14:06:18 -0400 (EDT)
From: CardSharks@aol.com
Subject: Re: T4.1 Char Gen Checklist

In a message dated 97-06-23 06:32:02 EDT, you write:

<< that anyone who can will pursue an advanced education >>

that any player who sees the advantage for his character...

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:23:19 +0100
From: John Wood <John@elvw.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Re: Hardware, firmware, software

Well, I'm back - and with a ton of mail to check through!
I've scanned the tml digests for responses, and gathered the PE software
answers for further consideration.  In case anybody's interested in the
OS response, so far I have 23 responses (including private mail):

    Win 95/NT:  12
    Some Unix:   6
    Mac:         5
    DOS/Win3.1:  4
    OS2:         1
    USR Pilot:   1

If a preference was stated, I've only included the preferred OS; if not,
I put an entry in each category.  Apologies if I've missed anyone.

This is enough to give me the answer I needed, BTW.  My preference is
for writing 32-bit Windows code since that's what is best for me, and I
wondered if there were a large enough audience.  There is.

OTOH, almost all the Mac users answered my second question, whereas only
about half the Win95 users did.  This makes it even more important to me
to keep as much code generic as possible.

Enough for now,

John (now happily married 8-)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:26:35 +0100
From: Roy Martin <roy@rtrm.demon.co.uk>
Subject: Task System

As a confirmed lurker, I have been following the discussions about the =
task system with much interest.  Finally, I have decided to raise my =
head over the parapet.  A few thoughts:

1.  I don't see the problem with throwing a large number of dice, =
especially if only for a minority of task throws.  It can even be =
satisfying, I seem to recall casting a few big AD&D fireballs in my =
youth.  Surely most rolls using KB2 would involve 2-4 dice.
2.  I agree with the many members of this list who do not like the T4 =
and T4.1 task systems, though they are both simple.  I have always liked =
the MT task system.  KB2 also looks good, though I have never used it in =
anger.
3.  Does the TML want an easy to use system that works OK in most =
situations, or a more complex system and 'realistic' system?

Roy Martin
roy@rtrm.demon.co.uk

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 12:36:27 -0700
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <dberry@hooked.net>
Subject: RE: Latest Vote Count (Dont forget me!)

At 08:52 AM 6/24/97 -0400, Volker A. Greimann wrote:
>
>Count me for the MT system.

Put me on that list also.  MT was the best task system Traveller ever had.
I will accept (and expect) a revision of the current system, but it should
have all the nice tidbits that made building up my MT task library enjoyable.


- --
+------------------------------------------------+
|   Douglas E. Berry         dberry@hooked.net   |
| Gearhead & Planetologist, Traveller since 1977 |
|         http://www.hooked.net/~dberry/         |
|************************************************|
|    "Traveller assumes a remote centralized     |
|   government (referred to in this volume as    |
|    the Imperium)...                            |
|       -Introduction, Book 4: Mercenary (1978)  |
+------------------------------------------------+

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 12:59:36 -0700
From: "Douglas E. Berry" <dberry@hooked.net>
Subject: Re: Marc's Comments and a suggestion or two

At 08:14 AM 6/24/97 -0400, Andy Brick delurked long enough to say:

>As for tasks, my belief is that we stick to the MT system or a minor
>variant thereof. My
>suggestions for such variations are -
>
>* Keep the ability to combine any skill with any attribute, it's useful

Second (or third) that.. using a skill that I'm very familar with, Rifle, I
can bring about the following tasks:

Rifle and Strength:  Firing the rifle.  (Str should be the controlling
attribute for gunfire, BTW.. every firearms course I've taken or taught
puts the emphasis on controlling the gun through firm grip and bracing.)

Rifle and Dexterity:  Clearing a malfunction (On a Spectacular Failure, the
weapon has jammed; this task is the attempt to quickly put the weapon back
into action.  A SF here mean the weapon is truely screwed, and needs a
gunsmith.)

Rifle and Endurance:  Fire in a timed match.  (Basically an endurance test,
timed matches are a bitch.)

Rifle and Intellegence:  Figure out the operation of an unfamilar piece.
(Never assume that all rifles are built the same.. if you don't know to tap
the forward assist on a M-16A1, you'll get a schock when it jams after 2 or
3 rounds.)

Rifle and Education: Identify a weapon.  (As a both a gun nut and history
freak, I can pick out odd weapons on TV, know what I'm looking at at
gunshows, etc..)

Rifle and Social:  ID showpiece weapons (A Hi-soc gunman will probably know
the difference between a Gridlore Technolgies "Rajah" Hunting Rifle and a
FS copy.)

One skill, six tasks, and that's just scraping the surface.

>* Keep the 3-7-11-15-19 sequence, maybe with Staggering at 19 and
>Impossible at 23 for
>compatibility with already published T4 sources,

This is easy to remember, and makes for a natural progression if you find
the need to go even higher  ("you are trying to explain to the Emperor why
you had thye Iridium Crown in the sack?  OK, Fast-Talk for 31...")
>
>* Limit skill levels to 5 maximum, 3 or 4 during character generation. I do
>this anyway and
>no one ever complains.

I'm not sure if this is a good idea.. I tend to tell my players that a well
rounded character is more enjoyable than a monomanical one-skill monster.

 The best way to achieve this is the use of "skill
>points" rather like in
>2300AD - divide skills up into Primary, Related and Unrelated and set
>prices for each skill
>level accordingly. That gives a nice balance and removes "Combat
>Accountants" from the
>game. It also forms the basis of a nice experience system.

Never really liked the 2300AD mechanics, so I have to vote against this.

>* Assume that an average stat of 7 gives no bonus, and use the 3-7-11-15
>scale to determine
>mods from statistics. ( so 2 is -2, 3-6 is -1, 7-10 is +0, 11-14 is +1,
>15-18 is +2 etc ). This
>makes Impossible tasks truly Impossible without circumstantial DMs ( Max
>skill is +5, max stat
>is +2, so +7 - you need a 16+ on 2D for Impossible even if you have Skill-5
>and Stat-F. Unless
>you get an extra +4 plus from somewhere i.e. a modifier for the situation,
>you are going to fail ).

I don't understand why people dislike the idea of dividing characteristics
by three to get the DM.  I'v ealready jotted down the ranges, and have a
space on the character sheet right next to the characteristic for them.
example:

STR  8/+2
DEX  C/+4
END  5/+1
INT  7/+2
EDU  2/+0
SOC  9/+3

So if this character had Rifle-2, his final skill would be (using Str) 4.

- --
+------------------------------------------------+
|   Douglas E. Berry         dberry@hooked.net   |
| Gearhead & Planetologist, Traveller since 1977 |
|         http://www.hooked.net/~dberry/         |
|************************************************|
|    "Traveller assumes a remote centralized     |
|   government (referred to in this volume as    |
|    the Imperium)...                            |
|       -Introduction, Book 4: Mercenary (1978)  |
+------------------------------------------------+

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 12:57:43 -0700
From: Scott Ellsworth <Scott_Ellsworth@alumni.hmc.edu>
Subject: Re: [T97#1444] Gushing about the new UWP

At 10:24 PM 6/21/97 -0500, you wrote:
>
>Scott Ellsworth <Scott_Ellsworth@alumni.hmc.edu> writes...
>
>T::>FWIW, I am finishing up a Python script that will generate such for the
> ::>empire as a whole.  I decided last night to break with published data,
and
> ::>generate my own physical data, with the locations the same.  My logic was
> ::>that I found it a bit strange, though certainly not unreasonable, that
the
> ::>average atmosphere was thin, rather than standard.  (I figured that if
the
> ::>Ancients had spread humanity over so many worlds, the least they could do
> ::>is terraform them a bit.)
>
> (A) What's Python?

A freely available language, written in C, that is available on most
platforms.  The strong point that makes it useful for this is that it has a
fairly rich set of data types, including dictionaries which allow
acceptably fast storage/retrieval of worlds by hex and sector.

Check out www.python.org for details.

The benefit is that since there are versions for Linux, Sparc, PC, and Mac,
I can write a script without really having to worry about what platform I
am using.

> (B) If it's comprehensible, please e-mail me a copy of the
> script.  I may want to port it to other languages.

Certainly, certainly.  When it is done, I will be glad to send it on.  The
present one that can split the large file into small ones, and that can get
a few summary statistics on pop and TL is only about 100 lines of Python,
and I suspect a pro could drop that significantly.

>T::>I am using a two pass system for this, which is really only appropriate at
> ::>the end of the long night, and if a computer is doing the scutwork.  All
> ::>worlds of pop 8, 9, and A will be placed first on congenial planets,
then I
> ::>will have each spread some colonies out.  In addition, I am going to
place
> ::>a few bizarre worlds here and there at random, though both colonies and
> ::>random worlds should likely be near a main.  I expect to have a roughly
> ::>similar distribution to that in the books, but with far fewer pop 6 or
less
> ::>worlds that are not explicit colonies of some bigger world.
>
> I _definitely_ want to see the computer program that does
> this...

Pass one is the easy one, as it is pretty much deterministic.  I am still
trying to decide how best to do pass two to produce a fun universe.  I
think I know how to do the clustering in a good way; create the total
population first, place it on the worlds where it survived, and then figure
that it will be rare to go beyond a few jumps, but I am not convinced that
what I have scratched together will make sense after a few passes.

FWIW, PE used three jumps as a magic dividing line, and so I only need to
analyze all the "good" worlds in pass one, and then all worlds within three
hexes during pass two.  Probably, I should set up trade routes for PE at
this time.

>T::>(I owe this fit of fiddling to Jeff Zeitlin and his alternative world
> ::>generation page.)
>
> ????  What alternative world generation page?

Oh dear.  My sincere apologies.  I cannot find the page I was referring to
now, but I shall give a look and post the proper credit when I can again
find it.

The page I am remembering included a world generation page that gave a life
rating for the planet, plus suggested shuffling the order slightly on the
various stats generated.

FWIW, I have mostly put together a different system, which will give me
more planets with standard atmospheres and 1G gravity on the surface.  I
also am fiddling with the PE rules to make resources the determining factor
for Ri/Po and infrastructure the factor for In/Ni, so the trade codes all
stay derivatives of the UWP.

This is waiting on my finishing my sector mapper and getting the first beta
to the half a dozen people who wanted it.  I can now at least generate the
executables for both Mac and Win, so there is some hope that it will go out
soon.

Scott
Scott_Ellsworth@alumni.hmc.edu   http://users.deltanet.com/~fuz
"When a great many people are unable to find work, unemployment 
results" - Calvin Coolidge, (Stanley Walker, City Editor, p. 131 (1934))
"The barbarian is thwarted at the moat." - Scott Adams

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 20:02:55 +0100
From: SD Mooney <dom@cybergoths.u-net.com>
Subject: ANOMALIES

Now Anomalies is out (and with a reasonably evocative title and Foss
painting !!!), I've a question.

YES, A NON TASK SYSTEM QUESTION!

Does it fix the problems with Core subsector, as promised?

Don't tell me *how* on the list if it does - I don't want to ruin it for
any players out there. (Tell me in private email if you will!) - just tell
me if it does!

Thanks

- --------------- Dom Mooney (dom@cybergoths.u-net.com)---------------
"The fall of Empire, Gentlemen, is a massive thing, however, and not easily
fought. It is dictated by a rising bureaucracy, a receding initiative, a
freezing of caste, a damming of curiousity - a hundred other factors."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Hari Seldon - Azimov's "Foundation"~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 15:51:12 -0500 (CDT)
From: lee@uansv2.Vanderbilt.Edu (Mike Lee)
Subject: New Gaming Term!

cajoule- v. The action of discouraging munchkinism by application of
electrical, mechanical, or thermal energy.
(ex. When Mike showed the player group his ex-Scout, ex-Navy, ex-Marine
character, with a UPP of FFFFF1 and an infinite repeating PGMP, the GM had
to cajoule him with a cattle prod to make him create a decent character.)
Measured in joules.

Many thanks to Harold Hale, whose typo gave me the inspiration. (and a lot
of laughs!)

Mike Lee

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:17:53 -0400 (EDT)
From: JumpSix@aol.com
Subject: New mailing list member...may I introduce myself?

Ya know I am REAL happy to see Traveller alive and well. I was just looking
at material I used to use when I started playing in high school (1979 or so)
I thought Id hit search on the internet and found yall! 

I like RPGing with trav however one part of the game I really liked was
playing Trillion Credit Squadron (High Guard Rules). I hope this part of the
game is being rereleased (yes I know about archives, I'm still searching em).

Anybody here still play trillion credit squadron? Any body playing it on the
internet or in west Florida (Tampa region?). Anybody stood in from of a Type
T spinal mount lately? (ya know, it's a little hotter than the Fla sun!)
*********

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 14:17:37 -0700 (MST)
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU>
Subject: Re: Minimum TL for...

On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Rupert Boleyn wrote:
 
> How about an alcohol engine or a ctalytic sream rocket? What TL do 
> you need to be able to make Hydrogen Peroxide? IIRC some of those 
> man-portable chopper thingies used catalytic decomposition of 
> Hydrogen Peroxide to power them.

Hmmmm...industrial catalysis on that scale would need the same kind of
infrastructure that IC engines would, I think. On earth, both were
outgrowths of the Industrial revolution.

Alcohol fuel, OTOH is available at quite low TL's, as all it takes is
knowing the fundamentals of distillation, and wood alcohol (methanol) or
grain alcohol (ethanol) are very easy to make this way.

Ethanol gives you the added benefit of being an instant trade good, too
;-)

Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 21:27:46 GMT
From: jlindsay@direct.ca (James Lindsay)
Subject: Coreward Maelstrom... a Vargr threat scenario

Anyone care to wager how much of a threat they would be to the Domain
of Deneb *if* the Vargr could all get along together (for longer than
a few months or so, anyways)?  I'm considering running a campaign
taking place around 1125 where just such a thing might be possible (I
haven't figured out exactly how, yet).  Even proof of such a possible
threat might be good enough for what I have in mind.

Now I don't need canonical arguments that point out that Vargr society
tend to be unstable due to their pack mentality-- of that I am fully
aware.  But how serious of a threat could the coreward packs be to the
neighbouring Imperial sectors *if* the Vargr could cooperate?

Do they possess navies capable of standing up to those of the Imperium
(details from the Frontier Wars are sketchy at best)?  Since larger
ships (which generally survive longer in combat) require much time and
resources to construct, do the Vargr even have such large capital
ships?  Or does their society's constant state of flux mean that few
such ships are ever completed and retained by their packs (ie: if
packs are constantly dividing and reforming, where do all the large
assets go)?




James W. Lindsay     Vancouver, British Columbia
  "http://www.prosperoimaging.com/ground_zero"

"Give me the strength to change the things I can,
    the grace to accept the things I cannot,
         and a great big bag of money."

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 14:55:55 -0700 (MST)
From: Bruce Johnson <johnson@Pharmacy.Arizona.EDU>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

On Tue, 24 Jun 1997, Peter H. Brenton wrote:

[snip]

> Well, if you want to get technical remember;
> 
> 1). Both 13.5 m^3 and 14 m^3 are approximations to begin with.  I'll leave
> it to more chemically oriented heads to decide exactly how many m^3 are in
> a displacement ton of Hydrogen (or is it Deuterium?...and what about water
> before refining?)

Well, according to my handy Merck's Index, H2 has a density of 0.07 g/cm^3
at it's boiling point, going up to 0.076 (or therabouts) as a solid. I
doubt that they store H2 in solid form on starships given the pressure
requirements, so I'll use the bp density figure.

A displacement ton is defined as the volume that 1000 kg of LHyd takes up.

So, therefore, 1 Td = 1000 kg * (1000 g/kg) * (1 cm^3/0.07g) *
(1m^3/1e^6 cm^3) = 14.28 m^3. So the FFS figure of 14 is actually the
correct number if you round to the nearest whole m^3.

Haven't a clue where they got the 13.5 m^3 number, but by the definition,
14 is the correct number, and the number SHALL NOT be 13.5 UNLESS thou
proceedest on to 14. 15 is right out! 

A displacement ton of LH2 in the form of water, on the other hand is a bit
harder to figure out. One displacement ton of H2, purified (we'll assume
we mean chemical, not isotopic purity) is 1000 kg * (1000 g/kg) * 
(1mole/2g) = 500,000 moles of dihydrogen.

1 mole of water = 1 mole of LH2 = 18 g

500,000 moles H20 * 18 g/Mole = 9e^6 g water. Fortunately, water is
another of our great constants so that 1 g H20 is 1 cm^3, so 9e^6 g H2O =
9 m^3 of water. 

Unfortunately, that 9 m^3 of water weighs 14 times what the hydrogen does.

Amazing what lugging around useless oxygen will do!

Bruce Johnson
University of Arizona
College of Pharmacy
Information Technology Group

Institutions do not have opinions, merely customs

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:03:48 -0400 (EDT)
From: CardSharks@aol.com
Subject: Re: Character Generation Pages in WFW95

In a message dated 97-06-23 20:16:15 EDT, you write:

<< 
 5.  On page 2 under MENTAL CHARACTERISTC EQUIVALENTS, only 1 point
 separates BS from MS and MS from Ph.D.  I think they're too close.
 Proportionately, it takes far more work to get a Ph.D. then an MS.
 >>

I'm looking at severely crunching down what levels of Edu mean... Attached
text from the Chargen tables.



MENTAL CHARACTERISTIC EQUIVALENTS
Value	Int	Edu
0	Braindead	Illiterate
1		
2		Basic Reading
3	Impaired	Grade School
4		Ed Certificate
5	Below Average	High School
6	Average	Associate
7	Average	Bachelors
8	Average	Masters
9	Above Average	
A	Superior	Doctorate
B	Very Superior	
C	Gifted	
D	Very Gifted	
E	Genius	
F

GRADUATE SCHOOL
	Graduate School is the first step in pursuing an advanced education. 
Prerequisite: BA, BS, or BFA.
	Admission:	 7 -; DM +1 if Int 9+
	Perseverance:	 7 -; DM +1 if Int A+
	Honors:	 4 -; DM +1 if Int B+
Academic Skills	Honors Benefits
	1	Jack of all Trades		Degree carries
	2	Academic	the suffix honors
	3	Instruction	
	4	Technical	
	5	Performance		Receive +1 Edu.
	6	Computer	
	Roll once per year or choose from Major.

	Declared Major: Indicate one skill within Physical Science, Social Science,
or Performance as Major.
	Education Increase: Edu increased to 8.
	Academic Degree: Social Sciences: MA; Physical Sciences: MS; Performance:
MFA. Degree is not granted unless Major level is 6+ (9+ for Ph.D).

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 18:04:21 -0500
From: "Joul, Christopher" <JOUC1@Aerial1.com>
Subject: Re: Suggestion for Task System Improvemet

Ken Wrote:

>Joul, Christopher wrote:
>> 
>> How about this as a suggestion to improve the weighting of skills vrs
>> stats.
>> 
>> Keep the target number determination the same = Stat+Skill BUT, Cap the
>> Target number to 7+2*Skill Level (since 7 is the average
>> characteristic).
>
>snipety do da.
>
>> This has many advantages:-
>> 
>> 1) It's Simple!
>> 
>> 2) Restores the importance of skills over characteristics.
>> 
>> 3) Doesn't break existing the existing published system assumed in PE,
>> GM screen etc...
>> 
>> 4) Reduces chance of success at high difficulties.
>> 
>> What do people think?
>
>Why not just go with KBv2.0?  It does all you mention above AND is a
>simpler fix.

What do you mean a simpler fix, it introduces a whole new concept of
'Experience Level', and doesn't use the same number of dice as printed
in PE or the Screen.

This suggestion was made to try and provide a compromise between those
of us who want to see a new task system (which weights skills more) and
those who did not want to change the system (not that they were happy
with the system, but because it would conflict too much with published
material).  Thus in rare burst of insparation I devised this minor
alteration.

Personaly, I would like to see the system used in T4.1 which:-

Valued Skills more highly than characteristics.
Used Characteristics at their full value (i.e. not devided by any
number).
Easily described (i.e. fits on a single sheet of paper).
Was simple to use, both in combat and out of combat.
Was consistant.
SF chance increasing with difficulty.
SS chance decresing with difficulty.
Feels like Traveller.

I know KBv2.0 meets this, but so does T4/T4.1 (with my mod above),
however some of the other suggestions made on this list don't.

I'm just glad that Marc has taken this oportunity to consider the system
he is going to introduce, and I hope that he can come up with a
solution.  But no matter what is developed as the Oficial system I will
probably use a hybrid of my own (since it is impossible for Marc to
please all of the people all of the time).

Chris.

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 19:16:54 -0400 (EDT)
From: RSpake2064@aol.com
Subject: Re: information...

every one this was an accident.... so please don't take offense, i was
makeing a template for a from my permenate records to mail to the list

richard

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:02:51 -0800
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu>
Subject: Re: T4 Task Rationale

Tue, 24 Jun 1997 12:15:16 MET, "Volker A. Greimann" <GREI5001@uni-trier.de>
>- -> Well, a Dex 7 is that average rolled, before any additional
>- -> character advancement.  That means that  a stat of 7 is
>- -> below average.  I would say that someone on the clutzy
>- -> side of average is not doctor material...

>No, it's the average of the general pop allright. You forgot about the
>aging effects! So the older people and the children are going to have
>lower stats than those "on their peak". That reduces the average back
>to about 7. (Also don't forget many characters never roll on the stat
>improv. tables, choosing skill improvement instead!

Well, this is debatable since you dexterity doesn't tend
to decrease until late in life (after retirement) and children
aren't usually doctors.  In any case, even if it were the
case I would say that someone who is totally mediocre is
hardly doctor material either (not without a lot of training
at least.

_______________________________________________________________
DSummers@Mail.ARC.NASA.gov

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 97 18:18:04 -0600
From: Glenn Hoppe <starcity@sk.sympatico.ca>
Subject: Re: Deckplan Question?

On 1997-06-23 17:55 thus spake Bruce Johnson:

>On Mon, 23 Jun 1997, Simon Early wrote:
>
>> Two squares = 13.5 m3, based on a deck-to-deck height of 3 m.
>> 
>> Two squares = 1.5 x 3 x 3 = 1.5 x 9 = 13.5 m3
>> 
>> Thus a 100 T vessel has 200 squares on its deck plan.
>
>So what do you do with the 50 extra m^3 your ship has? A displacement ton
>is 14 m^3 _not_ 13.5 m^3. Your ship has almost 4 more deck squares worth
>of space not accounted for...a tiny number perhaps, but LOTS of smugglers
>have gotten by with less ;-)

Deckplans allow 20% slop, and you worry about a piddling 50 m^3? :-)

------------------------------

Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 17:13:52 -0800
From: "David P. Summers" <summers@alum.mit.edu>
Subject: Skills = Stats? I don't think so

Tue, 24 Jun 1997 15:50:41 +0100,  "Silburn, Luke (Exchange)"
<SilburnL@logica.com>
><<Well, no. If you have most of the people coming out of
>the stat generation (ie you acount for the fact that
>stats are non-linear, and so don't have as big an
>effective range) with numbers that vary just as much
>as skill (ie skills are, say 0-6 and most of the
>characters have stats in the 4-11 range.) then
>skills and stat _are_ equally weighted.>>

>Firstly skills do not follow Normal bell curve. They are a Poisson
>distribution with a mean somewhere around 1. Loads of 0s, a fair number
>of 1s and 2s, but precious few 6s. Secondly, you are comparing the
>*full*, 0-6 range of skills against a partial range of stats (5-11). A
>more appropriate comparison would be a 'typical' stat range 5-11 versus
>a 'typical' skill range of 0-3.

Well, this might be an additional point (though is would still
reinforce my point about not comparing absolute values) except
that I don't agree that skills are going to follow that
distribution.  The fact is that, while the rolls follow
the bell curve, purchase of skills is on a linear cost
(rather than a diminishing return).

In any case, you would still have to take into acount that
stats trail off at _both_ ends of the range rather
than just one.

><<The only reason Dex 7 and skill 4 vs Dex 11 and
>skill 1 is seen as a problem is the desire to
>see skill weighted more heavily than stats.  But
>that is matter of personal opinion.>>
>
>The reason I find this situation a problem is that to me Skill 4 means
>'skilled professional', whilst skill 1 means 'apprentice/intern'.

I agree that skilled professional should depend on the target
number, rather than the skill level.  This is how other games
that use skill+stat systems define such things.

_______________________________________________________________
DSummers@Mail.ARC.NASA.gov

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Date: Tue, 24 Jun 1997 10:40:13 -0800
From: "William F. Hostman" <aramis@asylumbbs.com>
Subject: Corsairs

some people can't see a rationale for corsairs...

simple:
CT: the Imperium (Classic era) had ceased to bar member worlds from warring
with each other, instead prohibiting mass destruction

MT: the factions needed all the combattants they could grab.

M0: liscence them to prey upon recalcitrant non-aligned worlds and PE's...

William F. Hostman		If you were using Eudora Lite 3.0,
Mailto:Aramis@asylumbbs.com 	<-- that would be a hot-link 

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End of Traveller-digest V1997 #1471
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